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Zag · Tired of his old title

This resolves to a single word as the answer. The first step might be too much of an unexpected trick; I'll just say that they aren't cryptics. As part of the theme of this series, be sure to document your thought processes.

8 The person watching was a fifteen-year-old. O / T
7 The wealthy patriarchs went too far [with "it"] S / O
10 The study of the heart is like one who rides lighter than air devices. C / B
10 The glass building puts stress on something. G / E
7 The frame of the car is tiresome. C / T
11 It's an official blessing, having a vision defect which makes images mismatch. B / A

ralphmerridew · Daedalian Member

Hmm...

Well, "glass building" immediately suggested GREENHOUSE, and fifteen-year-old suggested TEENAGER, and the third clue split into two parts, all of the right length, so I'm guessing each line clues two words.

1) ??? / TEENAGER
2) ??? / ???
3) CARDIOLOGY / BALLOONIST
4) GREENHOUSE / ???
5) ??? / ???
6) ??? / ASTIGMATISM

Suspence · Daedalian Member

1) BEHOLDER / TEENAGER
2) FATHERS / ???????
3) CARDIOLOGY / BALLOONIST
4) GREENHOUSE / ACCENTUATE
5) CHASSIS / ???????
6) ??????????? / ASTIGMATISM
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Logain · Stretch Armstrong

first observation is that at least one of the two answers seems to have a double letter..but that could be a concidence of course.

2) /exceeds
6) approbation/

Suspence · Daedalian Member

1) BEHOLDER / TEENAGER
2) FATHERS / EXCEEDS
3) CARDIOLOGY / BALLOONIST
4) GREENHOUSE / ACCENTUATE
5) CHASSIS / TEDIOUS
6) APPROBATION / ASTIGMATISM

Now that we've got a full list, although some words might be a bit tenuous, my thoughts are to begin comparing the relationships between the two words.

Since we're not sure on all the words, my inclination is to start with the pairs I feel most confident about (probably 3 and 4). If I find a solid relationship between those two, I can then apply it to the clues I'm less sure of and either confirm the words we have or begin looking for words that fit the definition and the relationship I'm looking for.

As Logain mentioned, one word in each set has a double-letter, so that is a decent place to start when comparing the words.
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Suspence · Daedalian Member

Given that we're supposed to post our thought processes...

The double letters spell out EELESP. Didn't seem promising, but it was step I took. If this puzzle turns out to be about moray telepathy, I'll be kicking myself.
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Lepton · 1:41+ Arse Scratcher

I took those same letters (EELESP) and looked to see if they bracketed anything interesting in the other word. I got HOLD, L, and NTUAT, but it seems like a dead end. Then I made came up with my own puzzle.

Vagrant · Daedalian Member

Jumping in late, but my first thought when I saw what you've got so far is that if the incidence of the double letter is important then GREENHOUSE/ACCENTUATE is probably wrong. Looking back at the clue I can see that it is 'puts' not 'put' and would change ACCENTUATE, probably to EMPHASISES.
Again, assuming the incidence of double letters is important, if I was constructing the puzzle I would try to remove the ambiguity of BALLOONIST. Unless only one of the pairs makes sense.

Logain · Stretch Armstrong

OBSERVER might work better than BEHOLDER.

Side note...

Taking in mind there is some "trick" in the first step..
I noticed the total of all the numbers equals the total of all the words in the definitions.
Maybe the "half definitions" should be rearranged to make more sense as a full sentence with the correct number of words per line?

Just part of the thought process here and I didn't even try it yet.

Vagrant · Daedalian Member

The wording of the clues is strange as Logain has pointed out.

Some thoughts -
Clue 1: why does it have 'was' in it? It doesn't read any better that way.
Clue 3: why does it have 'is like' in it? I know these are not cryptics, but Zag writes a lot of cryptic clues and knows the importance of surface reading. The surface reading of this clue makes no sense. He could have put 'of' in place of 'is like' and it would have made a perfectly good sentence so I can only assume that 'of' wouldn't work where 'is like' does.

[edit] oh, and ONLOOKER also works for clue 1 to continue the double letter thing.[/edit]

Zag · Tired of his old title

Sorry, not double letters; that's completely coincidence. The initial trick to which I was referring you already got, that each line clued two words (which each had that number of letters.)

There are more incorrect-but-perfectly-reasonable-for-the-clue answers than I expected. The vision one is a word I had never heard before, but was my only choice for its purpose, so look for something more technical.

Re the weak surface readings: Sorry, I put this together in an hour. Also, since these don't have the additional wordplay you'd find in a cryptic, I wanted to make sure that they fit correctly w.r.t. tense of verbs, etc.

Elethiomel · Daedalian Member

5) CHASSIS / TEDIOUS

Coincidence?

Zag · Tired of his old title

Zag · Tired of his old title

Edited the clues slightly and gave an additional hint considering the number of incorrect-but-perfectly-reasonable-for-the-clue answers.

Elethiomel · Daedalian Member

1) OBSERVER / TEENAGER
2) DADDIES / OVERDID
3) CARDIOLOGY / BALLOONIST
4) GREENHOUSE / EMPHASIZES
5) CHASSIS / TEDIOUS
6) ENDORSEMENT / COLOURBLIND

Thinking out loud... replacing known wrong answers with my current best guesses.

Suspence · Daedalian Member

Zag · Tired of his old title

overdid and emphasizes are correct. You clearly missed the hint I added to the first note when I changed the definitions slightly.

Elethiomel · Daedalian Member

I just noticed the initials for each answer have now been clued in the OP, disqualifying some of my suggestions.

1) ONLOOKER / TEENAGER
2) SENIORS / OVERDID
3) CARDIOLOGY / BALLOONIST
4) GREENHOUSE / EMPHASIZES
5) CHASSIS / TEDIOUS
6) BENEDICTION / A... ?

Elethiomel · Daedalian Member

In the interest of documenting false trails, I briefly looked at anagrams earlier, since I noticed TEENAGER anagrams to GENERATE. But many of the other answers don't have anagrams so I didn't pursue this further.

But here's a more promising lead.

Zag · Tired of his old title

Seniors is still incorrect, but all the others you've written are right. I had considered "Arab" instead of "wealthy" for that clue, which practically gives it away.

There's also a hint in one of my later posts of which no one has noticed the significance, yet.

By the way, welcome, Elethiomel, to Grey Labyrinth! We're always glad to get new regulars who like puzzles. As you've probably picked up, Visitor-Submitted Puzzles is for original puzzles, or really, really obscure ones. Anything you might Google we've probably all already seen. You can post ones that are not original, but you should give credit if you can.

ralphmerridew · Daedalian Member

SULTANS?

I tried looking through http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eye_disease and googling "vision image mismatch", but couldn't find anything.

Elethiomel · Daedalian Member

Thanks Zag, from what I've seen this is a very nice forum with some extremely talented puzzle solvers and -makers.

In particular, I like your collaborative approach to puzzle solving.

I also figured Sultans must be it after giving in to the temptation and looking at Zag's spoiler. In alphabetical order, that gives the following 12 answers:

ANISEIKONIA
BALLOONIST
BENEDICTION
CARDIOLOGY
CHASSIS
EMPHASIZES
GREENHOUSE
ONLOOKER
OVERDID
SHEIKHS
TEDIOUS
TEENAGER

Zag · Tired of his old title

LOL. Not sultans, either.

I have to admit that I just tried to find the vision defect, and I couldn't find it searching forward from only my clue. I guess it's even more obscure than I thought. This might be a clue to the next step, that I had to use such a word.

The condition is, more specifically, where the images seen by two eyes are different sizes, one larger than the other.

Elethiomel · Daedalian Member

Sheikhs?

Edit. And aniseikonia?

Zag · Tired of his old title

Since these puzzles were specifically a response to a question "How do I get better at solving puzzles," I'd like to point out one of the comments someone, probably Suspense or Scurra, made in one of the other puzzles. I'll paraphrase, helpfully.

Experienced puzzle makers will usually put their clues in some order: either alphabetized by answer, or just by the text of the clues, or the length of the answers, or something along those lines. If they haven't, then the order in which they presented them is probably significant.

Edit: yes, both of those.

Zag · Tired of his old title

Elethiomel · Daedalian Member

Pairing by common three-letter combinations:

ANISEIKONIA + SHEIKHS
BALLOONIST + ONLOOKER
BENEDICTION + TEDIOUS
CARDIOLOGY + OVERDID
CHASSIS + EMPHASIZES
GREENHOUSE + TEENAGER

The triplets are:
EIK
LOO
EDI
RDI
HAS
EEN

Should be close now...

Tinhorn · f/k/a Dave10000

Close indeed. Nice puzzle.

Ironically, or for those who do not accept that usage, then coincidentally, essentially the same endgame as my puzzle here from years ago entitled "The More Things Change," which goes to show that the more things change ...

Completely different puzzle and way of getting to the endgame, though. And there are only so many endgames to go around.

"The More Things Change" can be found (though possibly with formatting issues) here:

http://www.greylabyrinth.com/puzzle/puzzle131

Zag · Tired of his old title

I'd like formally to give credit to Dave for that approach. I knew when I made it that I was copying from something that I had seen on GL, though I couldn't remember where. I remember thinking at the time how impressive it was that someone got it to work out so perfectly. I've since become a much better puzzle maker, and I know exactly how to make such a thing happen (obviously).

Suspence · Daedalian Member

Just to formally finish it off then. Take the 3-letter blocks from the first word in each pairing to get:

Elethiomel · Daedalian Member

Thanks, nice end-game trick there. I had a feeling that LOO was supposed to connect to that K in EIK but I wasn't quite there when I called it a night yesterday.